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Author Topic: Mech Hero Mercenaries  (Read 44471 times)

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Rodvil

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #15 on: June 28, 2010, 01:18:37 AM »

Adamsky, can you be a bit more clear on your coment?

I think that we all have a different view of how this could work. My view and the one I would like to try now is a Mercenary Alliance. I think that will help to get the advertizing for our services reach more players.
We could offer ourselves in big wars, but we could also help the little n00bs being bullied by bigger fellows.

It will be an alliance based on war and fighting more than city building!

Or were you thinking about being a merc and still staying in your old alliances?
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Zopyros

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #16 on: June 28, 2010, 03:09:55 AM »

Rodvil, I do not think you get the idea of a being a merc. Alliance?
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DukeM

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #17 on: June 28, 2010, 10:17:21 AM »

Rodvil, I do not think you get the idea of a being a merc. Alliance?

Zopyros, you should probably think through the merc alliance matter beforehand. What happens if the customer needs services bigger then what he alone can handle ? Or the customer demands services that are inconveniantly far away ? Thats were the merc allies kick in and either provide additional firepower or they are just closer to the intended target. Not to mention that a merc surely attracts some attention from the former victims and will be a target himself, who could use assistance in defending against retaliation.


I think what adamsky could have referred to, is the fact that one guy from an Alliance could hire mercs to attack a member of his own alliance or the members of alliances they have an NAP with. Not that i think this would be a big concern, there might be issues if you go down that path all the way. Just think of Afghanistan in the 80ies and Korea/Vietnam in the 60ies and 70ies and you know what can happen if you let two factions loose without the fear of assault directed at them ;)
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Rodvil

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #18 on: June 28, 2010, 01:26:03 PM »

Zopyros, I don't think you get the idea of a being a merc. Alone?

1st - there is still no concept of what it is to be a merc in Mechhero.
2nd - Theres not only 1 way of doing it for sure. 1 way will have some benefits and some drawbacks
3rd - I'm sure I get YOUR idea of what is a merc, I just don't fully agree.

And I completely agree with you, DukeM, about the benefits of the alliance.
If a player wants to go solo Merc, we don't even need to discuss it. Just start doing it. He doesn't need anyone else and he can set his own rules and modus operandi. (I already mentioned the problems he will face)
I can compare it with a solo mercenary soldier, or a full mercenary battalion. I'm aiming at the battalion.

Also we don't need to be a mercenary 100% of the time, sometimes we might just do our thing. The alliance will also give us an added layer of gameplay and power.
I'm a team player. I would like to see a strong team made of independent strong players. We have our freedom inside the group but we can also come together as one.
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sponge

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #19 on: June 28, 2010, 08:26:09 PM »

i think a mercs alliance would be an excellent idea....you could call it sweeping mechs or something
by having an alliance you could start a forum where people can bid for services
it will ultimately be a matter of good customer service though
you will need to give a guarantee of certain amount of damage caused in comparison to player size
im sure you can sort out the details yourself

"raging mechs"
"psycho mechs"
"big mechs with even bigger guns"
ok i know all my names are bad ...... :P
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adamsky

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #20 on: June 28, 2010, 08:41:01 PM »

I mean that:

If you plan to start a regular agressive alliance that has a leader and command structure and only replaces diplomacy with 'making jobs' than I'm ok with it.
If you plan to have bunch of independed mercenaries under one alliance tag than I'm out. :)

- 2 players cooperating is more than 4 independent players
- I don't want to end up with situation that I'm supposed to figth agains my allies (becaouse they got hired by the other side of the conflict)
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Rodvil

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #21 on: June 28, 2010, 11:23:24 PM »

ok... now I see your point, adamsky.

Like I mentioned before I see it as an organized group and not as only individuals. Definitely aggressive!
About command and inside structure that will have to be discussed by the first Mercenaries founders.
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Zopyros

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2010, 12:10:28 AM »

A mercenary works for himself first. If the job is too big for him alone, he brings a few of his buddies in from past conflicts.

You do not need an alliance to have groups of mercs working together in the game. The very idea of an alliance conflicts with the idea of being a mercenary.

If you make an alliance, you do not have mercs, and you are not a merc yourself.

A merc is alone. He does it alone, even when he has his buddies with him. He can back out anytime. He can quit anytime. If he does not like the way the job looks when he sets up, he can quit then. He can tell the rest of the mercs to get stuffed with no consequences, either for going on a mission, or not.

If you are in an alliance, you cannot quit. You must get along with others. You attract attention from the other so-called mercs to you, which you do not want. You are associated with the deeds of other alliance members, and not of your own glory.

You guys should look up what a merc is. You should watch some Rambo movies (especially the last one). You should look up the definition of a merc in the Geneva Convention.

If you want to be a merc, then be 'one'. Otherwise just run an alliance. I am not interested in being in an alliance. Trying it this game just to get some action. Got my wish. ;p
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Kalc Foo

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #23 on: June 29, 2010, 01:21:19 AM »

I took your advice, Zopyros, because I hate misinformation.  Here is a definition of mercenary.

http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/mercenary

There is nothing there that suggests they can't work in an organized group and still be mercenaries.  What is the Foreign Legion?  I just read about a company that hires out groups of mercenaries--Blackwater.  Here's the link for that.  (Go to the 4th slide.)

http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/1768/1/?redirectURL=http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-06-22/the-most-hated-companies-everhow-did-bp-score/?cid

They are called private military companies.  The owner or ruler of one or a group of Mech Hero citiies could be just the regional chief executive of a world wide mercenary corporation--in game terms, an alliance!
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I'm talking about mech fu fighting.

Zopyros

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #24 on: June 29, 2010, 01:43:48 AM »

You can get any definition you want on the net, if you take the time.

Read the Geneva Convention.

... What is the Foreign Legion?
The French Foreign Legion are not consider mercenaries under the Geneva Convention. Neither are the Gurkas, just in cause you use this later. It is all explained in the GC.

Blackwater is under investigation. Currently, the US is saying that they are not mercenaries. They are considered to be paramilitary, which IS NOT the same thing as a merc. This area is open for debate.

Haliberton, and its employees in Iraq, can be considered to be mercs. If a non-organized group of civilians are in conflict with a country and use force in conflict of that country when that country has not allowed them to be there, they are considered mercs. And as such, after a brief trial, can be shot. You have no POW rights as a merc. But under civilian rules, they can be considered just a regular old security company, and as such are not bound by military rule. Read the GC.

Now if you want to use the 'paramilitary' idea, sure that will work in an alliance. But a merc, or a group of 'individual' mercs cannot by definition be allied with anyone, not even other mercs. They must be able to come and go as they please. Sure they can form into a fighting force, but they do not ally. It is a job, nothing personal.

You did not read the GC. You did not watch Rambo.

Do not confuse paramilitary, militia, Government forces for hire (blackwater), civilian security companies in foreign countries, mercenaries, and for that matter guerrilla warfare freedom fighters. They are not one in the same. Some come close to being the same, but none are the same.


*Edit: Just read that link about blackwater you posted. And it just proves that even when you slap a few mercs together in a so called 'company' they are still out for themselves. If they stay in the group, it is just because of convenience, or a way that they can use to gain something else. They have no use for it other than this. But as I said, Blackwater is a grey area, and is still open for debate, even in current government political circles.

In an alliance, if a merc were to act like a merc, they would use that alliance for what they wanted, then through it away when done.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 01:52:29 AM by Zopyros »
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Kalc Foo

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #25 on: June 29, 2010, 04:14:04 AM »

The Geneva Convention has nothing to do with Mech Hero, and is not a reference for the English language, though it is a better reference than Rambo, which I first watched when it was released to movie theaters.  The English language sort of does have something to do with Mech Hero and its official forum, therefore references for the use of English, incontrovertibly, supersede any other.
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I'm talking about mech fu fighting.

Zopyros

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #26 on: June 29, 2010, 04:44:57 AM »

The Geneva Convention has nothing to do with Mech Hero, and is not a reference for the English language, though it is a better reference than Rambo, which I first watched when it was released to movie theaters.  The English language sort of does have something to do with Mech Hero and its official forum, therefore references for the use of English, incontrovertibly, supersede any other.
What?

We are talking about mercenaries in MH. GC is reference for the term mercenary. What better 'dictionary' then the one of the world?  If you are going to use the term, might as well play the part as the term is defined by the world. Otherwise do not use the term. Use another.

GC is also reference for the morals of world society, which is of high standing than english or any other culture/language/religion/trade/etc than any other book/video/movie/internet in existence, including the bible.
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Stu H

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #27 on: June 29, 2010, 06:35:34 AM »

GC is reference for the term mercenary. What better 'dictionary' then the one of the world? 

@zopyros.  Sorry you've lost it there.  Check the definition of dictionary, I doubt it mentions 'the one of the world'!

The GC as a set of rules for the conduct of WAR between COUNTRIES that are signatory to it, so has about as much relevance to MH as rambo.  And last time I did english in school (which admittedly was some time ago) we used a dictionary for definitions, not a set of rules of war.

You see the problem with such rules is the interpretation of definitions within is entirely down to the people who drafted them.  Just read any document that come out of the EU to see that in action!!

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/mercenary_2#mercenary_2__3 (Cambridge University)
mercenary noun  /ˈmɜː.sən.ri//ˈmɝː-/ [C]
a soldier who fights for any country or group that pays them

It does not say anything about organization, etc.  And I'll take a cambridge universities interpretation of language over the GC any time!!
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Zopyros

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2010, 12:22:45 PM »

mercenary noun  /ˈmɜː.sən.ri//ˈmɝː-/ [C]
a soldier who fights for any country or group that pays them

It does not say anything about organization, etc.  And I'll take a cambridge universities interpretation of language over the GC any time!!

The definition of a merc is not as simple as that. Read the GC. Has ANYONE read the GC? I see alot of words and quotes to dictionaries anyone can look up that has a finger and a PC. The definition in the GC is the one I will be going by. If you guys want to go by the dumbed down one in any dictionary you can find go right ahead.

No the GC is not technically a dictionary. But it is what the world goes by when conflicts occur. It is the book for the 'definition of war' and the 'rules' you are supposed to follow as a human being. And mercs are what makes the conflicts alot more difficult to find a solutions and put a definition to.

Again i say, read the GC. No one here has read it. If the had they would not be quoting the Oxford, or some hoity toity Cambridge rag. ;p
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DukeM

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Re: Mech Hero Mercenaries
« Reply #29 on: June 29, 2010, 12:36:27 PM »


The definition of a merc is not as simple as that. Read the GC. Has ANYONE read the GC? I see alot of words and quotes to dictionaries anyone can look up that has a finger and a PC. The definition in the GC is the one I will be going by. If you guys want to go by the dumbed down one in any dictionary you can find go right ahead.

No the GC is not technically a dictionary. But it is what the world goes by when conflicts occur. It is the book for the 'definition of war' and the 'rules' you are supposed to follow as a human being. And mercs are what makes the conflicts alot more difficult to find a solutions and put a definition to.

Again i say, read the GC. No one here has read it. If the had they would not be quoting the Oxford, or some hoity toity Cambridge rag. ;p

The GC is a political treaty that was signed to bind the signing states to a code of conduct for armed conflicts. It is therefore a compromise between the signing states and prone to the shifting realities in politics and between the signing states.

France, a state with nuclear arms, has no mercenaries ? I wonder why.

The USA, has no merceneries or keeping this debatable ? I wonder why.

I can tell you why, the GC might be unchanged for decades, but the definitions of the terms used in there aren't unchangeable and will change at any time most of the signing states think it is conveniant to them to change those definitions. Sometimes they don't even care and deliver chemical weapons to some dictator, no matter what the GC says about such things being naughty.

So the GC is not a dictionary and it is not a "Manual for Warfare" it is nothing else then a political Treaty that is prone to any changes in the Political Climate.
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